Harold (Aggy) Marshall aged 94
Speaking to a meeting of the Greenhow Local History Club.
At Coldstones Quarry, Greenhow on Thursday 5th December 2002
Transcription of the Recording.

Harold Marshall is in black.
Mrs Marshall (his daughter) is in green.
Others are in blue.
Red text is when I suspect I didn’t understand but made a guess anyway.
??? are words I know I didn’t understand…

Disk One
Track One

For anybody that doesn’t know, this is Harold Marshall.  ??? Harold was actually born at White Row in… (94 years ago) 1906… 1908.

The first recollection back in… – but I can’t put a date to it now.  The first recollection was the bonfire up at Copson’s Ear to celebrate the crowning of King George the Fifth. (There are some photos…???)  I remember I wasn’t all that pleased about it because I wanted to have my best suit on which was a blue sailor suit.  Handed down… from my cousin. It was a velvet.  Which I understand now why they didn’t want me to have it on at a bonfire anyway.

If you would like to ask any questions… I’ll answer them… as best I can, anyway.

You worked as a guide at Stump Cross Caverns, didn’t you?  Do you remember that photo?  Do you know those people? (Photo handed to Harold Marshall) It was taken in 1931.  There are some names on the back but there is one person unknown. Mr. Gill, Clem, Sep.  Sep.  That was old Mr. Gill, wasn’t it?  What was the ???  I don’t know if it was Mr. Gill or not.  Clem Smithson – he couldn’t read or he couldn’t write.  Malcolm had worked it out that it was probably Clem Smithson.  I received e-mail this week from ???.  From ??? who was a guide there at one time.  It is Clem.  I don’t know the other chap.

I was a guide there.   As a teenager??? , I imagine.

Did you get many visitors then?  Were there many visitors at Stump Cross?

We were there some months ago.  Debra, my great-granddaughter.  My daughter… And Debra wanted to bring her.  The Miners, they don’t care if you bring children.  They are really good there.  We went to the caverns and Debbie had a cup of tea, ? cup of coffee, scone, a big pat of butter and a bit of marmalade, jam or something.  I just had a cup of coffee.  I was ???. She saw that I was studying…  and said “What are you thinking about Dad?”

I was just thinking that for 5 pence more I would have to work 10 weeks to pay for this.  5 pence more. Cup of coffee… 35 pence. 7 shillings a week, 35 new pence-With tips.  Where the tips were material.  And you were lucky if you got tuppence, lucky if you got sixpence – Really lucky.

I did once get half a crown but then I had to share it with old Thaxter.  Thaxter was the senior.

He was a man who came to Greenhow with his wife.  And they had been in the D???.  He was a keeper.  He had his arm shot off from something he shouldn’t have been doing. It was a trap was it?  It was a trap for… Poachers.  Hmmm, (yes).  Well he came to Greenhow.  He had a little farm.  And then…well… he got behind.  He worked a little bit at Mr. Varvill as gardener.  And then he was the senior man at Stump Cross Caverns.  I don’t know how much he got a week – it wouldn’t be much.  Whatever tips I got I had to share with him.  Whatever tips he got, he shared with me. But, I will say this, he were better tipped than I was.  Because I think people felt sorry for him because he had a crook. ??? Instead of a hand, he had a crook.  So, I think people rather felt sorry for him.  Instead of me getting thruppence? (3 pence) he would probably get sixpence.

What years were you guiding at Stump Cross?  What year would it be?

I would think it would be 1923.  It was a year after Professor Long and them had been down the caverns.  But they did come quite often there.   And I do remember…I never cared for Professor Long, as they called him.  But I did like one of the chaps that were with him.  And that was Johnny Churchill.  He was a cousin of Winston Churchill.  A very nice chap.  Particularly because he gave me a block of Bournville of chocolates.   I think he felt sorry for me.

Do you remember if there was ever any public transport from Pateley Bridge through Greenhow to Grassington? No… not to Grassington.  There was a bus up on a Saturday.  Nothing has changed, then…  We’re still in a time warp.  There was probably one round about 1 o’clock and one about 5 o’clock.  And then the last bus up was after the pictures had come out.  Really, not much traffic in those days, of course. Didn’t those people walk places then instead…motorbikes???  Motorbike…You were lucky if you got a cycle….   not much use to you. Because you would have to walk anyway.  We did have them. They were good for going downhill…

Do you remember the road being tarmaced?  Yes.   I remember it ???. What year was that?  I don’t remember the year.  I remember when it was just the loose chippings.  First fall off the motorbike.  It must have cost 8 pounds but I fell off of it before you get to the Miners.  I scraped myself on the chippings on the road.  I remember when carts use to cart the??? limestone down to Pateley.  There’s a place just opposite the club, I don’t suppose it’s there now, there’s a recess in the park wall.  That’s where they used to tip a load of cobbly limestone.  And then they would be broken up by old men.  Well, it weren’t fun!

There is one just at the top of the lane there.  Just the same, the recess there.  That was the store. ??? I remember my grandfather and grandmother, one time, he used bricks in there.  I remember the little hammers he had and glasses that were…not glass, but mesh, wire mesh, to prevent the stones flying up in your eyes.  It was quite a new thing was when tarmac came on.  It was quite a thing.  But, before that you were just water-bound and the road was all stuff off the quarry and watered down.

They used to take from the quarry a load of stone to the top of Wellic bank and put it onto a sledge there and then come back for another load of stone to the quarry.  They could go down all right.  And then it had to be trans-shipped.  It had to be…the cart had to be unshackled on Birch Flat.  And brought back to the sledge and then it was off again.
 

Track Two

Do you remember going down towards Pateley, the old stone quarries down at Noonstone.  Were they working? – Not Noonstone… down the old back of… Do you mean Middle tongue? Aye, yes! Middle Tongue.  Ah, yes! Yes, they was working.  That was sandstone, of course. Of course.

Were they working limestone on Dave Prince’s land?  You know, at the top, just past Toft Gate there are two lime kilns just below the road.  Yes. Were those being worked then?  No, I don’t remember that. So they were older than that, then.  At ToftGate, itself.

I can only remember the two limekilns here.  Those two at Duck Street, I never remember them working either.  So, there was only the Coldstones ones working.  I remember the Coldstones, yes.  In fact, my grandma brought me….  I was chesty….  And she brought me to get a fuse.  I don’t think it was a good thing at all. You’ve lost it! Dad, You've lost it! I say you’ve lost it!

Mentioned on one of the old census - down these parts – not far from White Row – There’s a group of houses called Marshall Row.  Do you remember where they were or what they were?

I wouldn’t know but there’s a lot of Marshalls at Greenhow.  Three of my uncles, three of my grandfather’s family, married Marshalls.  Not exactly inter-marry but two brothers married two sisters.  And one of their cousins married my great-aunt Georgina.  Georgina was called, she was the eldest, she was called Georgina – had…my uncle Orlando was the next oldest…had he been born first, he would have been called George, you see.  But he wouldn’t have been called Georgina.  George was an old family name.  George, Johns, Williams, Jims. Kings names.  I don’t know why they got Orlando – why they called him Orlando.  But my cousin, Leonard, he was known for years as “Crafty”.  He was all right.  He was one sound chap.  But, he was a handy man.

Then my cousin Joe, later called Joe, but he was christened Granville.  And for years he was known as Summit.  Then, he started working at Middle Tongue Quarry .  At that time, he was dressing wall stones. He had these over-alls.  And, I don’t know if you remember or not but there is a pocket down the side that you can put a two-foot in.  His two-foot was missing one morning.  He was creating about it and my uncle, Harvard, who was called “Matey” (I don’t know if anyone remembers him now), and they christened him “Two Foot Joe”. Well, the Two Foot was in his sock.  After that he was called “Two”.

Then there was Reggie was called “Punch”. My uncle Jack, died when he was 49, ???.  He worked at Cock Hill.  The two of them started there… Cock Hill.  And  Strod Simpson.  Opening the Level up ???. I remember him saying, this is my uncle Jack, there’s millions of gallons of water dammed up there.  Well, I was terrified that it would all come gushing out, you know, when they were.  Cock Hill Level heads straight for… I don’t know how far  – but you can go up - I think it’s up to Church Lane end, Church Lane end, straight.  When you get to the top you can see a little pinpoint of light at the bottom.  I used to worry about this millions of gallons of water. And after school, I used to run down there hoping not to see gushing of water coming out of Cock Hill.  Cause it was… It was just a trickle – just a nice trickle, anyway.  And I used to walk up.  There were four standings where you could pass you, four standings.  I use to walk up in the dark.  One foot on one rail and the other on the other rail, and walk up to the first standing, couldn’t hear anything, walk up to the next standing.  Then to get up to the third and then Charlie, Charlie was a little horse that pulled the wagon. Pulling it up, because it came down more or less on its own. As soon as he saw the pinpoint of light at the bottom he went hell for leather down there.  There was no stopping him.  You had to be in the standing to be out of….  That’s right … wild horse… I was very relieved when there was no gushing of water, of course.

My uncle Jack died when he was 49.  He was quite a clever chap, was my uncle Jack, – the best educated in our family, anyway.  He was known as “Bob”, “???”, and “Captain”.  He would answer to any of those.

And my uncle Jim was called “Butch”.  He was only a small chap.

My uncle Fred… What did they call him …  “Dodger”  He was a clever chap.  He had a good education.  He would have been a good engineer.

Orlando never got anything good… a by-name as they call it. Anybody on Greenhow was always called (by his) by-name.

George Mackwell, his father was called "Old Dazzler".  George was called "Young Dazzler".

You were called Aggy for what I know. I don’t know where that came from.

Then Fred Longthorne, you’ve seen pictures of him, he was my mother’s cousin, actually. His mother was a Marshall.  He was called Reggie.  I can’t remember what old Will was called.

Do you remember a family of Walshes.  A family called Walsh - in the early 1920’s.  No.

There’s a memorial stone in the church yard.  Two dead soldiers both called Walsh.  One died in France and one died in Pateley Bridge. Sorry, Swales!  Swales family…

My cousin Lorrie was engaged to Leonard Swales.
 

Track Three

He worked then for Campbells, Bobby Campbell and Miss Campbell.  They lived in Pateley – Bobby Campbell had quite a bit of property.  In fact there is a bit of a relationship somewhere, because they came wanting…there was some money left in chancery– but we never got anything, of course, but it were through him they were trying to get it.  And he was one of the relatives going back a long way.

On Greenhow, there’s practically… very few people that weren’t related one way or the other.  We were all… There were enough Marshalls - we could have a cricket team.  And not a bad one either!

Do you remember where this Swales family lived?

Yes, Bent’s farm.  Heyshaw. Behind Greenhead, across the fields from there.  Mrs. Swale was, a Barker, probably a bit related to my family.  She was a Barker before she was married.

Were they a wealthy family?  No. (You’re talking about Greenhow!  Who was wealthy!).  Very few people wealthy on Greenhow, I'll tell you. Its just the fact that they brought the memorial stone all the way up from Pateley Bridge and plonked it at Greenhow.  I find that a bit brass.  No.  (Perhaps they used strong people! They carried it up! Maybe the regiment contributed to it.)

There’s three surviving after they were killed.  Harris Swales married Martha Thameson and finished farming at… near Pateley…near the… Watermill? Corn Close?…  Yes, Corn Close.  His older brother, Jimmy Swales… he married a Simpson.   Mrs. Simpson was one of Lonsdales to begin with.  And their daughter, Nancy, lived in Knaresborough.  I’ve seen her quite often…In Knaresborough… Years ago, of course – she’s dead and gone. ???

You worked down Cock Hill for a little while yourself, though, didn’t you.  I did, yes.  In the mines, yes?

Cock Hill – I remember Arthur Storey.  Mike Storey that started the quarries here.  They were related - their Mother was a Marshall – she married a Marshall.  Married Jack Storey.  And William Storey worked for a time as a nipper at the mines.  They remembered they went in Cock Hill and came out at one of those shafts before you get to Stump Cross.  Near Jammie Mine? I can’t remember the name, No, above Jammie – went in at the bottom. – I forget how many miles of horse Level there were and how many miles of mine level there were available to go into from Cock Hill.  Duck Street went to join.  Some went to Duck Street and the others went to others.  I have myself gone in at where… where Fred Longthorne lived and there’s Green's down in the bottom.  The farm that used to be Green's.  Far Side?  Low Far Side.  Low Far Side.  I’ve gone in there, there was a chimney came up there. That’s right.  I’ve gone in there and come out at the bottom. And I’ve also gone in at the bottom and come out at this top.  One time… when Dipson was the man that started opening the level out – don’t know how far his money went.  But I remember when whoever took over – they put out this pump which was a wonderful thing.  Six thousand pounds – it was a terrible amount of money in those days.  And they had these two engines, two boilers, down below in Cock Hill.  And one of them.  I remember going to Fowlers -  taking the smoke box, part of it to be done up. And that was done up and renovated at Cock Hill - down in the bottom.  And at the top, they had a look ??? That used to go down the chimney to provide steam for the pump down below.  The pump – it was an expensive thing but the point is - they got so far down and then the clack would come off.  What ever the clacks are around ???– there may be more then.  I don’t know how many there would be of this.  But, if that came off, ??? then it stopped pumping you see.  So then the pump had to be raised to adjust the clack.  And by the time they got it done, the water had come so far up again they were at a loss.   They never really got down to the lead that they were getting to at the bottom. Arthur was in charge of the pump.  Freddie Heaton, from Glasshouses, was one of the nippers - Full 24-hour job, three shifts.  And Freddie, I remember Freddie Heaton, came to collect my uncle - the pump wanted mending again.  This is given a night, around about 3  o’clock in the morning when he came.  My dad???? Went to the window – oh, it’s Freddie – clack’s come off.  I remember my aunt saying that my uncle said – don’t bugger about the clack.  That meant that he had to get out of a warm bed to go and mend it, you see.

This railway engine that they had in Green's field… it generated most steam, but it lost quite a bit going down.  All the parts were covered in asbestos.  I remember when we were stripping – we had to take all the asbestos off to get the pipes.  This was when we were finishing there.  Do you think you could claim for asbest-iosis?

The first mines that I can remember were the ones at Jammie.  And then after that when they started it up again it was primarily for spar and then it was at Gill Heads.  They got quite a bit of metal over in Appletreewick mine and that was put in there fresh plant in that did it.  Remember when the stuff had to be transported from the Appletreewick mine, over the moor, over the road, and to the dressing plant at the top of Gill Heads where there’s plenty of water.  There’s no water of course at Appletreewick at the top. ??? The first engine they had was a very nice little steam engine.   Could bring about four wagons of stuff over from Appletreewick. My Uncle Fred drove that, but I don't think they paid for it, it went back.  The difficulty with mining is money, you see.  Sometimes there’s big money and sometimes there wasn’t.  If you weren’t getting any lead you weren’t getting any… nobody wanted to come into it, anyway.  There was a millionaire called Templeton, I think.  He was good, stayed at the mines for a while.  But, after the steam engine went away, Teddy Busfield, he was on one of those photographs, and myself, we were drivers of the locomotive.  It came from the Wembley exhibition.  It was a  Fordson locomotive.  Fordson locomotive.  Coil ignition, very bad to start, started with petrol and then went on to paraffin.  Difficult to start.  We ran that for quite a while -  bringing stuff home from Appletreewick.  Then the money went down.  And they started at number two then.  They got permission to... The pipe track is Bradford Corporation, they tunneled right through from Merryfield, right through under Greenhow, it comes out before you get to Skyrholme.  A lot of work was done - what we call opencutting.  That was cheaper than tunneling- Cutting a trench and putting the pipe through that way.  Because, it had to be diverted to different levels, of course but….  Going on to Greenhow, they struck two veins of metal. Engine bank, at the bottom of Engine bank – that’s near where Bruff used to live.  And they said it was a yard wide.  Which was quite true.  Because this was all supposition – people telling you they'd struck this metal, because it was beyond Greenhow miners to get it out.

Eventually, they got permission from the Bradford Corporation to use the... to use the shaft at Greenhow.  But they had to stay so far away from the pipe, you know.

How far down the shaft were you working?  I can’t remember how many fathoms it was.   I made a mistake there – that was one of the biggest mistakes I ever made, I think.  The money was getting done.  Mind you it wasn’t... They were cutting the wages down on top.  This was …
 

Track Four

A lot of the work on top, we were on top, were at a greatly reduced… – mind you, wages were pretty good in those days, really, for working at the mines.  They had to pay wages in order to get people to go.  They weren’t reducing the wages down below so I said I “Mr Varvill, I'd like to go down below”.  Money was… better, better, much better, down below. He said, you’re making a mistake, Harold, he says “You won’t like it”...  I didn’t like it, he was right.  I couldn’t stand the ammunition smoke – that really did me.  I’m chesty to begin with. It really upset me.  I couldn’t face my stacker. There were two shifts, a morning shift and an afternoon shift.  The morning shift was all right.  We went into clear air, compressed air had driven the smoke out and you were all right for that shift until you drilled a set of holes and had to fire them just as you were ready for going out.  But the next ones had to go into it, through it, more or less.  That was the snag. That wasn’t very nice. It didn’t suit me at all.

We were in the bottom end.  I forget these names.  But Jack Smithson and… Jack Smithson was one of the men that were in the metal.  But I do remember it and it was so wide.  And it was a lovely sight, going to look at it after the fire, you know. ???  It was a lovely sight to see.  But it only nips in and narrows down, you know.  So, there’s only a narrow ledge, the veins...  It could be wide or it could be narrow or it could go to nothing, almost.   And that’s was the lovely sight -  they were making a bit of money there but they were spending it in trying to find something somewhere else, you see.

We were in the bottom side... Can't remember the name but I was with George Mackwell. I was with... No, Clem Smithson was with George Mackwell on one shift, and Fred Busfield... Fred Busfield was known as "Jock", the foremans son, Ernest's? son, ??? son, we were partners. That was Jack Busfield's son then?  Yes. Jack Busfield, he married Barbara Calvert.  They may have had a son called… it's escaped me... It’ll come back to you… Sydney.  Didn’t you mention a Sydney? Sydney is in some of the photographs that Peter gave me, that Peter Boddy gave me. Sydney Calvert. Sidney was Fred Busfield's son.

But the Busfield's... In 1918, there was a flu epidemic.  Jim... known as Butch was a grave digger and he had to dig a grave for the eldest of Jack Busfield’s sons – who was called Albert - just had his calling-up papers to go in the Army.  And the youngest child, a baby, I think they called it Elizabeth or Nellie. They died from flu.  I remember seeing the little grave by the side of Albert's grave in the cemetery.  And when they got back from that funeral, the middle boy was dead in their house.  There were three in that family killed by flu.  Do you remember how many deaths there were on Greenhow?  Did they bury him in the cemetery or the church yard?  Cemetery.  My uncle said that the first person to be buried in the cemetery was somebody that was killed in number two shaft.  He fell down, didn’t he?, they didn’t know who he was.  He was a stranger.  Yes.   I don’t know but he was the first one to be buried in there.  That’s right, yes.

Did you go to school at Greenhow?  Hmmm. I don’t know whether somebody was pulling me leg or not but they said you could tell somebody that went to school at Greenhow because when the school closed halfway during the Second World War they all had to go down to Pateley Bridge and they were the only people in the middle of winter in Pateley Bridge who didn’t have any shoes on.   They were wandering around in their bare feet.   I don’t know if they were pulling me leg or not.  But… Can you confirm that?  That kids were running around in bare feet in the middle of winter? In Greenhow? In the 40s...

No, we had clogs.  You had clogs…Do you ever recall any kids ever running around barefoot?  No.  Only at bedtime…  Did they sleep with their clogs on?

Clogs… I remember the clogs.  After they got wet inside then they used to put hot cinders into them and rub them about to dry the clogs out.  Not very good for your feet.

Was there ever a shop at Greenhow.  Yes.  There was?  Do you remember where it was?  It was that house that was pulled down - the old post office.  White Row, was it?  North View ??? The old post office.  Don’t know…  You don’t recall the shopkeepers name, at all? Yes, Jinney Smithson.  She was a Hall before she was married - Jenny Hall. Do you remember who ran the post office?  Yes, Jenny Hall… Jenny Hall? Well, Jinney Smithson.  So, it was a shop and a post office, all in one, was it? Yes. It  suited…

They moved the post office at one point, though, didn’t they.  It’s been two places.  Did the shop go away?   The post office and shop were opposite to the chapel.  And then, after that, the post office moved over to what we call Low Row.  ??? On the common.  Yes.  Uncle Tom’s Road.

I used to do my shopping there.  It was open in the 60s - 60s and 70s, wasn’t it?  We used to do our shopping there.

Remember Mrs. Smithson when she was at this one, she used to take in boarders.  This was when the mines were going at Jammie. She would take boarders in then. Was Jack Smithson her husband, then?  Jack Smithson lived there. Was he related to Jinney Smithson? Oh… well they would be related somewhere, yes.  What was Jenny’s husband called?   I don’t remember but I remember that they only had one son.

Old Jim Roads? used to travel entourage???.  When he wasn’t traveling entourage???,  he was ??? Mrs. Smithson.  He did the farming, as well, there.

Do you remember the school before it was extended out?  When… it was Fred Lohgthorne told us that about 200 kids went to that school.   Is that right?   Or is that one of these tales?  He said that if you were last in, you couldn’t sit down.  Before, when they just had the original school, and the bit at the side was the schoolmaster’s house. And then, was it in the 1930s, they extended the school...  So it was two rooms and they built a new house for the school master at the end.

I don’t remember.

Had you moved from Greenhow then?  He had moved by then.  I don’t think….

I just wondered where all the children came of a sudden.  Was it when they were building the aqueduct?

I just remember my uncle saying that he went to school and he had to pay so much a week.

What do you remember about going to school.  Do you remember your school teacher’s name? Yes. Did you ever get caned?  I was a pest!

No…I did get caned, yes.  What was she called Dad?  Annabelle.  Annabelle who?  Anna Bell!  Anna! Oh!  Anna… Bell!

Was there just one teacher at that time at that school?  There was a younger one.  When I first went to school, it was Miss Hat. What year would that have been when you first went to school then?  1911 – 1912.  They sent you early out of the way.

So, you would have been how old?  Four.  How old when you left then?  Fifteen.  Fifteen?  That was late, really!  You should have been out working.  You should have been out cracking at fourteen!!!  My dad had to!  She did her best to try and get me through grammar school but she didn’t succeed.  I was brought up by two uncles, you see, and they spent as much money as they wanted to and they wanted to make you work.

Did you go to school in Greenhow?   Hmmm...

What did people do about the shopping.  Where did they get their food from?   They wouldn’t be self-sufficient at Greenhow.  There was Stockdales, Harrisons, ??? and Verity's.  All that people come around to see what you wanted.  I worked for Stocdales for 17 years and we used to sell feeding stuffs, coal, paraffin, and groceries.  The groceries used to come in a box with a lid on - a returnable box.  Inside, was paper – tissue paper – it used to come in handy.  The ladies used to claim that.  They had to have something that wasn’t shiny, anyway.

Did you have to sort of …You couldn’t put an order in, or anything, could you, really.  Couldn’t put? You could not put an order in because that would mean going to….  Oh yes!  You order from one week to the next, is what I meant? Do you? If you came one day, and boxed up, then you’d say, what do you want next week when I come on.  Oh no, it was delivered a day or two later afterwards. I see.  I used to travel for certain days and you went around for the orders.  Of course, they made the mail order came from the farmer and the grocery order from the lady, who was at the house.  Yes.  I remember one… Simpsons, Jim Simpsons down at…  come on – he’s thinking!  – he never went anywhere – and I remember his wife saying “??? Sit down to and bugger his hair”.  I cut his hair as well as take his order.  But, she was not very – I think they...  to her.  The order didn’t seem to… What she got didn’t come to what she had down on the bill and at the finish – the carter, it was delivered by hores and cart up to Holebottom.
 

Disc Two
Track One

Who lived at Holebottom, then, when you were there?  There was a big house was there at Holebottom?  Or was it not called Holebottom, then?

Holebottom sat at Griange's and then King's, two lots of King's in Holebottom House. And then there were a row of cottages that were made into a… youth hostel? That’s what I meant… I remember…  Was it a row of cottages, then?  (Yes) Ah…  I remember calling there - Bin Hannam.  And there’s his photograph somewhere - I’ve seen it.  He was crippled with rheumatism – worked at the mines – he lived there. And, somebody, one of his friends, is there to this day,  chiseled out on the rock "God is Love". I don’t know whether you’ve seen it or not. Ah yes…???  It’s still there ???.  It really shook him when he saw it, you know, because he wasn’t able to get about at all.  He was a cripple.  He was – I think he was the first person I ever remember that was in a wheelchair.  I remember, Squire Yorke, him being in a wheelchair – the old squire.  This is going back a bit.

Did you ever go grouse-beating?  No, I didn’t want to.  Do you remember a big party ????  I had no desire to go.  Was it ??? tight with the money?  ah, yes – we can change that… It’s against my principles to drive something to its death.  Soft.

You mentioned Mr Varvill earlier on.  Many of us have often wondered - What was his first name.  Wilfred.  He’s listed as W.W. Varvill.  I don’t know what his other “W” is.  Wilfred.   He came from up north. And... Wallsend on Tyne... and from a contractor’s conveyance from the mines that came from Wallsend.  When he came to Greenhow, he had two maids.  One was Peggy - married John Busfield.  And there was another one.  I can’t remember her name but I wrote love letters to her - but, on behalf of somebody else!  She got tired of Greenhow.  She came from Newcastle and it didn’t suit her down here.  And she went back to Newcastle but she still wrote to Harold Mawer.  Smiley, as we called him.  Smiley couldn’t really read or couldn’t write, I don’t think, much.  Would I write back to her?  I shall have to see what she has written.  He wouldn’t let me read what she had written.  I had to concoct a love letter to her. It didn’t go on forever… Did you always write what he said?  Did you write what he wanted?   I was a scribe.

Where did Mr. Varvill go when he left.  To Derbyshire.  Derbyshire…to work in some other mines and stuff?   Yes.  I wrote to him.  I had to have a reference, well, I had to have three, actually, for a job I was putting in for.  And I wrote to him and he wrote back and he said that he was surprised that more of us hadn't got away from Greenhow.  Nobody wanted to live in Greenhow then because there wasn’t any work.

I heard that in the 1920s that the road going towards Stump Cross way fell into the old mines. Pardon. In the 1920s I heard that the road going towards Stump Cross that way before Keld Dyke fell into the old mine workings. Do you remember that?  Jammie?  No, before Jammie.  No, I don’t remember anything before Jammie. Right, right…

Work was hard to get.  When the mines closed in the 1870s, things got bad.  The Marshall family - Some went to Huddersfield – and some went to near where Post Hill is.  What do they call that - The town there?  My grandfather’s family went to Cullingworth.  Which is between – it’s sort of a diamond shape - between Bradford, Halifax, and Keighley.  He got a job in the mill there. And my uncle Jim worked half time in the mill and half time went to school.  But, my grandmother never settled there.  She didn’t… She had one child there and that was enough. Decided she would come back to Greenhow, which she did do.  She walked from Cullingworth to Greenhow carrying the child.  She didn’t get all the way in one day.  She, what they called nightened, at Barden with somebody that she knew there.  She took the same house that they left.  Nobody came to Greenhow, you see. She took the same house that they left – at White Row.  Borrowed a bed, ??? and a chair from Uncle Toms. Uncle Toms – that’s my great uncle.  They lived very frugally.  They lived in the row below White Row and they sort of weathered the storm.   They didn’t want to leave.  And my grandmother wrote back.  She wrote - she wouldn’t go to the house.  It was Mountgarret’s house of course.  And Newbould was the keeper.  So she got that.    Wrote to my granddad – she wasn’t going back to him – she got him a job.

William Storey and Mike Storey married cousins, distant cousins.  William Storey was the surveyor at the finish for Ripon and Pateley Bridge District Council.  Mike Storey was the head-master at Bewerley school but he also had the quarries round about here.  He did start up a lime... I remember the place, just this side of the… just below here – there was a building and they made lime – same as they do at Grassington.  That didn’t go on for very long.  Anyway, my grandfather and them all came back and the family made White Row – they built a new part on to it - the back bedroom… Back and...

How many of you lived in the cottage at the end?  How many were there in one cottage… where you were born?  Seven. Seven. It was only two bedrooms, wasn’t it?  Three. Three.When the extension went on… Pardon. When the extension went on… Hmm. Yes.

I can remember going around when they were empty and derelict.  And there were ammunition boxes.  They would use the ammunition boxes to make cupboard doors – they used the wood.  I can remember. ??? I CAN REMEMBER, saying "Danger" or something on it. When they came back…the corner cupboard – there wasn’t a corner to put a corner cupboard in there so my grandmother had somebody come to take the cupboard doors off and build a cupboard into the recess.  And that rather spoiled the corner cupboard job.  I remember that.  I remember there… my grandfather had a big brown tin bottle with gunpowder in.  And he also had a coil… I remember, this was under the stairs...a coil of fuse.  But my uncle Jack he was… they were on the gelignite.  So it had to have lead in it.  I was warned not to touch those.  They were up in the cupboard, I remember.  Brass that fit onto the end of the fuse.  Jack Smithson used to use his teeth to nip the fuse! to nip the... Crimp the detonator onto the fuse.  Too dangerous, you know!
 

Track Two

He was the one that there when I saw the guide light down in number two.

Did you use Neddy well for water, then?  No.  No.  Neddies well - except, when a sheep fell in.  Somebody left the door open and a sheep fell in and drowned.  It had to be clear.  Where did you go then for water?  Well, we could have gone to the draw well at the Miners.  But, my grandmother wouldn’t have the water from there.   So we had to go David’s well, which was below Green's, Low Far Side.  Just this side of the beck – just this side of the stream there.  Yes.  Yes, I know….  If you go there, there’s a... (just down to the side of the beck) that’s David’s well. David’s well, aye… But there’s also another… there was a pipe came out… you know that building - observation place at… above number one.  Up on the hill above.  Well, below there, there’s a pipe came out that had water and we could go there… Pretty much away from Greenhow… Up that side.  How long before you went back to Neddy well, then?  It would be a month or two.  Aye...  Who tried it first? Remember carrying water for Winnie from it back in the 60s.  My uncle Jimmy used to carry water for auntie next door and carry for the teacher and sometimes for uncle Freds, as well.  He was good water carrier.

Do you remember the houses they built this side of the school.  On the old map, well, not so old, there were 5 houses this side of the school. Above the school? This side of the school. Well now… there was two, now there’s one.  The quarry side of the school.  One been pulled down.  One of those was built for Fred? Marshall, or something.  That’s where old Thaxter first came to – in the first place.  And they had the top house.   And there was a house at the top that he used for keeping ??? in and what not.

A lot of these houses were vacant, you know.  Nobody wanted them on Greenhow.  My uncle said that he could have had…bought… those two houses opposite…Where you lived, there was two cottages, just up above. Those two cottages where ??? live now.  Where Mrs. Whitehead lived?   Opposite… Down off the common –  and it’s the first house on the right hand side.  There were two cottages there. Dalton House.  Yes.  He could have bought those for fifteen pounds.  Fifteen pounds!  Because one was empty.  And our Katie Storey lived in the other.  Katie and …. ???. There’s no call for anybody wanting any property.  There was no work!  Mi??? I don’t know if you know ???.  Mildred Thoms? They lived where the last post office used to be.  Where Liddle's had it.  They lived there.  My uncle lived in the top cottage.  And Uncle Toms lived in the middle - always in the middle.  And, at the bottom end that’s Jimmy Newbould and Millie, who’s dad set up house when they got married .  But then an old chap named Fielding lived in that one.  He used to be a fiddler up at the church…chapel.  They had a little band of some sort at the chapel – and he was a fiddler there.  Some people didn’t understand.  His son, or grandson, ended up as a postman at Nidd.  Do you recall… know… who else was in the band in the chapel?  No, I can’t remember.  I know we used to have the chapel – there was two queer places at the far end of the chapel.  The Simpsons had one and we had the other taken.  You know, pew rents .  They were they only ones to pay pew rents.

Do you know whereabouts your family came from?  ??? How long did your family live on Greenhow?

I think they come from, originally, from Derbyshire. Derbyshire… Hmmm…

Ah, how long ago would that be?  Probably before the Grassington mines started. Right.  Hmmm…

So, they probably came in looking for work, maybe?  ??? north looking for work, maybe?

It was the lord of the manor and then he had the mining rights at Grassington, and he… Duke of Devonshire... Duke of Devonshire... Duke of Devonshire.   And then, of course, when the mines started over at Greenhow, they would come to Greenhow.  Right… Hmmm
 

Track Three

It’s time you stopped…

Any other questions?  Well, we’ve covered Greenhow pretty well!

What did you do for amusement? ??? What was the…???? We had tons… We had a lot of amusement!   ??? Ask you when first came up.  Sports ??? Carried on. [lots of background talking]

Well not very much any way.

One of my first memories…we had “socials”. Yes.

And sports – you had sports, didn’t you?  Oh Sports, sports, always. Sports here was always the Saturday after the Pateley Show.  Ah…  Was that what was called the Greenhow feast? Hmmm.

We used to kill a beast... Kill a beast?  for the Greenhow feast.  Was it in the field above the Miners… this side?  Yes.

I had a good day one sports day… Three firsts, two seconds, and one third.  I think the total was about nine pounds odd.

What did you win? There were only two runners in it!  The fell race, the local mines race... And I think some ???, I think,  a wicket.

What was the mine race?  Mine race… It was twice round…from the front of the Miners, up by the church, turn left, along Duck Street and then left again, back down the lane …Twice around.  That was considered to be a mile.

Yes, it would be.  Pretty level, then.  No hills!  Fell race on Greenhow!  How do you do a fell race on Greenhow?   ??? It was an easy one.  One of these…I never lost a fell race at Greenhow.

Have you seen that photo before – well, it’s not a photo – it’s a postcard of the Miner’s Arms.  Yet, have you seen what they have done behind it?  Artist license!  They put a hill behind the Miners!  ??? They must have thought …

Did you have to do a lot of snow shifting…by hand? Yes.  Especially on Duck Street?  Or everywhere?

They put the Miners down at the bottom.  It was sort of employment to us.  I remember er…

Going back to Mrs. Smithson, I used to think that I could never fancy anything there.  You could be getting a bit libelous, dad, really, you know.  You shouldn’t mention names. Well, this particular day I said I couldn’t fancy anything in there… I set off on my motor bike to go to Pateley.  I was working at Pateley.  I got past there.  And I got to the new road end and I got stuck there – so I came back.  By the time I came back, the wind was sucking the snow up into the carburetor.  That conked out.  And I pushed it from just along here to Mrs. Smithsons at the post office.  Could I put my motorbike in to the shed?  Yes, put it in there and come in when you’re finished.  I went in and she had a pot of tea for me.  I said I couldn’t fancy anything there but it was one of the best pots of tea I’ve ever tasted, I think.

I went down to Pateley and stayed there until the weekend an came back...  and by that time things had altered.  I came back up on the bus and I propped my motor bike up against a chest of drawers in Mrs. Smithson’s shed and Rupert come in, luckily, and said the chest of draws...  squashing the motorbike.
 

Track Four

Jinney Smithson took in boarders to ???.  I remember somebody called Hall drinking out of teapot spout.  That’s one of the things…I couldn’t fancy anything there.  And he ate half of his Yorkshire berries…rice pudding… out of the thing and put the rest back up on top for somebody to finish off.

Did you used to stock up in winter just in case it got really snowy?  I supposed they would do.  Because everybody baked.  There was no buying bread, I think. Where did you get the yeast?  Pardon?  Where did you get the rising agent from to make the bread from to make bread up here?  Mrs. Smithson’s… it used to come… in a block.  It was a sort of a sealed container.  That it came in.  Yes, but that would come from somewhere else.  It would come from a wholesaler or something, would it?Would it come up on the train, did it dad?   To Pateley?  Yes.  I would say so.
 

Track Five

What did you get for Christmas?  What did you get for Christmas box?  An orange?  An apple, an orange, a spice pig.  And that was it.  Right… And you were lucky! Yeah.
 

Track Six

There, you see… what would we do for entertainment.  Well… we used to have concerts and plays.  Ruby Bruff was a great one for, er… she were a great producer of plays.  She was the daughter of the...  The first I can remember of her was at a social at the church schoolroom  … it was on the Saturday night.  And she danced, and danced…  Something by Cherry... and singing and Cherry Ripe, Cherry Ripe...  And she was dancing.  She was wonderful – that was the first time I ever saw her, I think.

Mrs Bruff - I can remember the best. She had sort of a mock… leopard skin… coat.  She was nice, were Mrs Bruff, Charlotte, they used to call her.  She wrote to me quite frequently after she left Greenhow.  From… she went to Sweden.  Ruby married Ulf Barkman.  About 6 foot 6 - or something like that.  He was in the Swedish embassy.  They was in the embassy at Canberra and the embassy at… was it not USA?  Yes. ??? And Mrs. Bruff… she went out to Sweden and she finished up there.  Ruby came afterwards.  I had been traveling and my wife said Ruby Bruff’s been to see you. By then, they called her Mrs. Barkman but she was always Ruby Bruff.  She was staying at the Majestic – would I come and see her?  So I went to see her – Ruby, at the Majestic.   That was the last time I saw her.  She was a great one-a  Tom boy really in a sense.  She used to go out with the lads – as if… but not as a girl… she used to join in with whatever we were doing, window tapping or er, teasing people.  I remember Ruby Bruff .  Teddy Busfield was still saying… Ruby Bruff… she’s home and she’s got some crackers.  She’s got ??? some roman candles, presumably.  She was a good sport, was Ruby.  She had… she wrote a play.  ??? By then I was a goodie.  Ruby was my mother.  And ??? Oldfield had to shoot me.  This is part of the play.  It was my cousin Richards starter pistol.  But it didn’t go off.  And I was …and Ruby says – Die! Aggy! Die Aggy!… I was waiting to ???  I do remember that part about it and ??? she was comforting me and Mrs. Willy King was in the front row and she burst out crying.  She couldn’t bear it.  It was a rather prolonged death, actually.  I could die more quickly but then…

That wasn’t the only time that Mrs. King shed a few tears ???.  I do remember… I had a reasonable voice and I used to sing at concerts and socials.  I remember she requested me to sing  “Jesu, Lord of my Soul”.  And I obliged her and she shed a few tears, did Mrs. King.  ??? Probably. ???
 

Track Seven

Stop, dad, now.  STOP.  You’ve been talking for an hour and a half! Without a drink!  One of the first… Would you like a cup of tea? One of the first I can really remember was Arthur Green singing "The Farmers Boy".  I do remember that.  Would that be Beryl’s dad – Arthur Green?  No, Arthur was Beryl’s grandfather.

I carried… I was a bearer at Arthur’s funeral.  In those days, there were no hearses or anything.  You had to carry ...the coffin was brought to church in a - oh, it might be a horse and cart, or something like that.  But, it was conveyed from the church to the cemetery by bearers.  And sometimes you were honored by asking to be a bearer.  I was asked to be a bearer by Arthur Green – and he was a big chap!

Going right back – to when anybody died.  There was no telephone.  No means of anybody getting to know it - to let anybody know.  And, my Uncle Jack was one that was asked to ask people to ...  You were… he used to say… you are bidden to somebody’s funeral at such and such time, such and such a day, at such and such a place.  He had to convey that message to over... Other people were doing in other places.  But he used to do Hardcastle and Holebottom.  Today there’s nobody at Hardcastle – but there was then.
 

Track Eight

And it used to be – we used to have a little service at the house before we went to the church. The coffin lid wasn’t screwed down until the last moment. Never was a nice thing to see – a dead person.
 

Track Nine

Dad, everybody else has a hard seat except you and me!

If anybody wants question or I should have asked him something rather. You surely have something more to ask me!

Do you know where the missing lake is down Stump Cross?  I went with George Gill, Harry, and two chaps from the University.  They were student doctors.  We went down at quarter past nine on the Saturday night and didn’t come back up until half past two on Sunday afternoon - looking for this lake - and never found it.   They’re still looking for it...  So, who was it that said in the first place that this lake was there?  Well… I think it was a mistake because at White Cross - do they call it? there was a lake there.  White Scar! White Scar! Went there the next year, you see, and found a lake there.   You see, Professor Long left Greenhow to go there.  That would be where they would get the idea that there was a lake.
 

Track Ten

I remember there was four cottages just on the corner there- At Keld Dyke.  They’re all pulled down now. Is that where the old allotments were – on the side of the road there?  There’s a big patch of rhubarb growing in the middle of his field.  It’s always amused me.  Old Henry Newbold used to live…  That used to be a chapel – but in front of it there was these four houses. Are they garages now?  Now, I never knew anybody living in them, at all. On the other side of the road to the chapel?  No, same side. Same side.  They came right down to the road.  Right.  Where Jack Busfield used to live – I don’t know what they call these places now.   There was a cottage there where Mrs. Nichols lived. That's pulled down. Do you remember Rose Cottage? Just down here – down Coldstones. Wasn’t that where Mr. Nichols lived?  Opposite Coldstones, dad? Mr. Nichols…  No, he lived down behind Round Hill, that's pulled down now.  Rose Cottage or Round Hill?  As far as I know its pulled down.
 

Track Eleven

At one time there was 200 people lived at Hardcastle. 200? 200 people... Wasn’t there a public house there as well?  There was a public house at… behind Bruffs there on that little lane.  And they said that Bruffs house was a public house at one time.  And they said that White Row was one, too.

Was there a brass band at Greenhow?  Yes.  It was still there when you were small, was it?  No.  So, when did it disband – you don’t know?  ??? I can judge it by when the organ in the chapel like so many other chapels in the country.  When the organs came the brass bands were kicked out.
 

Track Twelve

Church became popular when a Mr...  Well, he was the victor at Ripley and he came over to Greenhow with his wife to be parson after Porritt, Porritt had two sons.  And, she died only a few years ago - a very old woman - in Harrogate. Mrs Porritt  I remember her bringing me some ??? when my ??? chest complaints.  Quite a nice person!  And there was her sister, Miss Porritt, that we used to pick… cowslips for to make wine.
 

Track Thirteen

Also, we, occasionally, we... there used to be a well down in Sand Gill – that’s halfway between the Miners Arms and Cock Hill.  Don’t think it’s probably there now.  ??? No…  My grandmother would never have water from the… drawn there, after all.  Because she said, her father said, that there was a sand bed... came down from the water in the church yard… came down the sand bed down to the well.  Where the well is - It’s known as Barker’s Spot – used to be known as Barker’s Spot.   My great-grandfather was called Bonny Barker. Your great-grandad was Bonny Barker, right… Was he a local policemen at one point in time?  He was, yes.  Didn’t care for it.  He got ribbed so much he gave it up. Right… Tom came in... and he took the handcuffs and the baton on this plate to him and he scampered up to the top.  He only did it for fun, really. They had a certain place at ??? where they would get away from our place anyway.
 

Track Fourteen

Thank you very much!  Very enlightening.  We really enjoyed it – on behalf of everybody. [Applause…] ??? All night then - I have to go to work in the morning???

Tell me where you all live!

I live at Halifax… Halifax… Oh well…

Down where mother and father used to live, you jnow where mother and father used to live?  Do you know where ??? used to live?  Yes. Just behind there.

I used to live at Hollin hill which which was Lord Mountgarret’s shooting lodge. And then I moved to Sunnyside Farm at Moorhouses.  On a hill?  On a hill – yes.

Is that where I wanted to retire to, dad? You ??? did.

Near Brandstone Dub bridge? Yes.

You and I used to walk around there and I just jokingly said, oh, that’s going to be my retirement home.  And when it came up for sale…I live over near Thirsk.  I rang up.  I should have known. Who was it that sold it -  Strutt and Parker or one of these fancy …  And I rang up and asked for particulars, you see.  And it came – but there was no price on so I rang her back   Really posh, she was. And she said…I thought she said four to five thousand!  I’m going back a little... Four to five thousand years, er pounds.  And I thought OH!…. and Mountgarret still had the rights… mineral rights, and shooting rights, and once you got the electricity in, he had the right to tap off the electricity!  I thought four to five thousand… what a lot of money!  It was forty-five thousand!  I thought four to five thousand pounds was quite a lot!  Forty-five in the middle of nowhere with no electricity as there was then.  And all these rotten ???.  Is that when you bought it?  Yes. That’s what it was. Can't remeber how much we paid for it.

The bridge over the beck there.  They call it Brandstone Brig. Brandstone Brig?  They used to have sweet... sheep washings there.  Oh, did they?  Because my daughter used to dam up the stream there at the beck.  She used to swim in there.  Perhaps that’s very ??? And I thought there used to be a smelt mill down there.  I saw it on some documentation … there was a smelt mill at one time.  A long, long time ago.???  There is a level that goes in there. That’s what I was going to say yes - just below the bridge, there’s a level, isn’t there?  Just above the bridge. Below.  Well, there’s one below, as well. Yes, I’ve seen one below.  Doesn't go very far.

Was that a Corpse road – they used to say it was called a corpse road - they used to bring bodies out from the mines… down the road there?  I don’t know. ??? High ??? You’re up at the top levels there.  ??? Would it have been Jimmy Newbould's old place - where Jimmy Newbould finished up... next to the school?  Oh. When we first came out, we bought the school and then Jimmy had left it that… which had first option on his house… because we bought the school off of Jimmy Newbold.  And then he died while we were down in Bristol. Bristol, yes… And we said no – we couldn’t afford it then.  And so we left it - but then we had a chance to buy it off of the man that bought it off of Jimmy Newbould.  So, we live in Jimmy Newbould's - where he finished up.  I think… was it somebody called Simpsons?  There were two cottages.  And one’s fallen down.  Do you mean above the school?  Yes, they joined on to the school.  They built the school and then they built these two cottages.  And then apparently there were added two on the back.  But they sort of fell down.

I’ve got a house where Jinney Smithson lived.  Do you?  Yes, it became the old filling station when those houses were pulled down and I’ve got a house on the same site.

And you?  We live in a field next to the old oak.  It’s a new house.  1977 house.  77-78… it was built…next to the old hall.  Next to … ?  Village hall…the village institute. Oh! It was a field, probably, when you were here.
Next to the old Sunday school.  Next to the old Sunday school?  There were two houses there. There is now.  We live in the big one.

High Redlish farm – on Duck Street, High Redlish... about half a mile from the Greenhow - Duck Street junction.  Two cottages – two places.  I live in the bungalow but I own the other house as well – the original farm house.  Do you know anybody that lived there?   No.  Can you remember?  ???, you remember Jagged living there last - didn’t you? Yes, Tom Jagged!!!  And Agars lived there, I believe, before that… Do you recall Agar?  No, I remember of them, yes. I can’t remember ???  Mrs Jaggard, she was crippled with rheumatism. I think they would be up here, don’t you, when you think of the climate.  A lot of people must have ended up with rheumatism.  Tom Jagged did.  I don’t know Who’s who… you have to be careful what you say..Msr Jagged… ???  The parson from Darley… I was at a service and he mentioned about …and then they were perfectly well. ??? Be careful what you say about people…

We live in Kiplings Cottage – next door to the Miners.  Kiplings…  Yes.  The poison well. She owns the poison well.  The village institute used to be on our front lawn - the old institute.  It was probably that one where you always said there was a path and we walked through somebody’s garden…because you said it was always a path.  There used to be two cottages in between our house and the road right there.  Those were torn down, I think, in the 50s.  There used to be a pair of joined cottages and then our house is behind where they were. Have you got a picture? Dad?No. The Miners – look at the Miners and it’s on your left.   You get the other half of it.  Joined up to the Miners?  No.  There’s the roadway isn’t it?  There’s a truck. ??? That one.  That’s nearer there.  It’s down here, isn’t it, Shana?  Yes, those were the cottages that were purchased ???  right there.  The driveway right there.

I remember his funeral.  Who used to live there?  ??? He lived on his own.  The first chap I can remember is ??? .  And then after that Jimmy Newbold  had a ??? there. ??? Near the well.  That’s what they used to call Barker's spot – behind the well.  It’s in my bedroom!  My great-grandfather – where he would be born…probably.  There was a little place joined onto that – that they used to call the Pleasants.  Chaps in their early teens used to go and play dominoes and what not.

You know where I live!

Low Far Side.  Low Far Side… is that straight down from where the Longthorns used to live? Straight down from the main road, yes.  You are Far Side and then Low Far Side.  Is that where Arthur Green used to live?  I don’t know.  He’s not old enough!  Straight walk from the Vicarage – straight line - straight down to the bottom.  ??? New Road , is that. And the road then branches off and you come down before you get to David’s well.  It’s right by the stream… Gill Beck.  The Panty Oon stone...???... Sun Oon Level. Yes, what he said.  ??? Old old map.

My uncle had a little farm.  Uncle Jim set him up.  And this… times were bad.  It was ??? day. And my uncle said he left himself something.  He was tired of making up ???.  So Bill Roland took the calf down to Pateley so to take it out to auction and when he came back.  Oh!  Jimmy Roland, he was the son, my Aunt Martha sent him over to ??? to milk the cow, which he did do.  And then Bill Roland coming down the lane singing.  They tell me ??? He spent quite a bit of the money in the pub and bought a goat.  That was the end.  He wouldn’t pay any more money.  My uncle was very careful with his money.

Harold, we would love to hear more but Fay? has a long way to drive back!
 
 

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